Monday, November 15, 2004

The Vin Saga

Alright, so here's the low-down. (I'm actually typing this "tonight" instead of "tomorrow", but I may update or add some stuff tomorrow, because it's 2:30 in the morning and I don't want to say anything I'll regret). (Note from "tomorrow"... I haven't even read this over, but I'm going to post it and just trust myself that I wasn't too psycho last night).

Just as a warning, this will be somewhat personal and perhaps reflective, so if you don't want to hear the "drama" and my reflection, don't read this!

Anyway... kind of some history, which as Vin and I learned tonight, matters! First of all, I told him in the very beginning that we should have been friends... I thought the relationship would be better platonically. He liked me though, so he wooed me and I was like "eh, whatever, I like guys who like me, this will work". Never thought anything so intense would happen. Then a week or so later I was kind of like "hey, we need some space" and he said "if we enjoy spending so much time with each other, I don't understand why we can't spend each and every minute of the day with each other". Whatever, dude. I don't care, and I have plenty of time to myself while you're at work, so whatever floats your boat. I found out tonight that he finally realized that those things were true... we are better off as friends, and you can't rush into a relationship like that. He said "you're way smarter than I am, and you know yourself way better than I know myself". Yup. (and all of this is not saying anything negative about him, I heart the boy, but it's just interesting)

So last Wednesday we had that good talk, kind of aired our grievances, etc. Then Thursday, Friday, and Saturday, he BARELY talked to me. He didn't come visit me at work, didn't meet me for dinner before work, talked on the phone only a little, sent only one email which sounded like he was irritated, etc. I knew something was up, just didn't know exactly what and didn't really worry. Today I woke up at 3 PM (ugh, I like to wake up closer to NOON on my first day off!) and gave him a call. He was like "thank goodness you're up, I can finally go get lunch now!" So we went to Red Robin for lunch, had a lovely meal, discussed the weekend. He said he was crabby because Bush won (I kid you not he's been crabby since the election) and was just really irritated with Christians in general. Then we came back to my apartment while he did work. He did work and I journaled and talked online and just relaxed. One thing I journaled was "God, I don't really understand why things aren't really going as well with Vinnie as they were before, are you trying to teach me not to date non-Christians?" Just kind of a thought, eh, whatever. So then, and I don't know how this happened, Vinnie and I got into this big long conversation!!! We were talking about all sorts of stuff and he was talking about Bush, etc, etc. and basically how stupid Christians are and whatnot (for the record, I happen to have voted for Kerry... Russ don't kill me if you read that). But anyway, that's irrelevant... so he's all "I don't think you're stupid, but you haven't personally tried to pass a law because of your own moral values". He also said that someone told him long ago that he gets too committed... meaning he tries too hard to make a relationship work, even when he shouldn't be. So I said "maybe we should break up... you sound like you're just too scared to do it because you want it to work, but it sounds like deep down inside that's what you know you want". We talked some more, talked about going to Barnes and Noble and he was like "it's open 'til 11, we can still break up and get back together 4 more times before then!" It was one of those nights where you kind of know you SHOULD break up but you don't really want to so you go back and forth just discussing. He said "what if I said I do think we're better off just being friends, because we can be best friends because you being a Christian doesn't effect our friendship"? I don't know what I said, but that was kind of just the moment. I cried. I got over it. I'm too rational to cry about anything for long. I kind of have this pattern when I'm upset about something: cry, then talk logically for a few minutes, cry, then talk logically for a few minutes. Then I give the brain-dump to Julius, who is patient enough for me always to listen. Vin just kind of sat with me while I talked to Julius, which was sweet of him. Then we decided we were going to be best friends. He made me promise, which I almost didn't, and then I realize that I'm in a position that I CAN be best friends with him.

We've probably always made more sense as friends, but we were both (and probably me moreso) in a position where we're alone in a new state that we're going to live in indefinitely but don't know anyone in. And we're both people that want to "have someone" to be around all the time (even though I haven't in 3 years) so it was "convenient". There were so many convenience factors to the relationship for me. I like him yes, but as he says he's nothing that I ever wanted. Which is weird, because the relationship seemed to WORK so well, but obviously it just wasn't meant to be. It's hard to explain at this point, my head is still in overdrive analyzing. The last two relationships I've had ended because of a single reason. For Doug, it was the distance that was a deal-breaker for him. For Vinnie, it was me being a Christian. Interesting that they both call the relationships "perfect except for _____". Guys seem to have these things that are just deal breakers. I look for the big picture, and for me neither of those things was a deal breaker. I don't know.

So Vinnie was way nice, and stayed at my apartment until 12:30 AM, even though he has to work in the morning. We just talked, and I kind of explained a lot about the way I feel about God that I'd been sub-conciously filterting before. Now I didn't care how it made him feel, so I just told him. I cried maybe once more, but since he left I haven't cried. I don't cry when I'm alone, because I have the time to think and be rational. Around other people sometimes I just feel like this "pressure" or something so I cry because I don't know what else to do. I don't know, that doesn't make any sense. So I don't know when I'll see him next, but I'm sure in the next couple of days sometime. He said he'll call me tomorrow, and he obviously will.

Random musings from the evening:
- He was kind of funny when he was like "how would we raise kids? You'd want them to be Christians, I'd want them to be atheists, and neither of us would even CONSIDER the other possibility!"
- I always talk to Julius whenever I'm super emotional. And he always listens. He's detached, but he's so patient with me. I know he thinks I'm crazy for it, but he has no idea how much I appreciate it. He lets me just give him the brain dump of all of the "heat of the moment" insanity, and then I tend to get over it. Thanks Julius. :-)
- I was way more upset about breaking up with Vinnie than I was about Doug.
- He said he's not sure how I can be a girl because I’m so put together and rational (when he was leaving and he hugged me goodbye, and I just hugged him back).
- We both wanted it to work, and yet he decided it couldn't. I find that interesting.
- He explained to me that he was a Catholic who became agnostic who became athiest, but when he met me he wanted so badly to believe that he became agnostic again. The past 4 days he talked to lots of his friends who made him realize that he's really athiest. (great.) He also said that he is depending on his friends to teach him about himself.
- He realized that I know myself very well and I'm very secure with myself and know what I need. Like I need reflection time about relationships and stuff so I'm very careful to take it. He wasn't as deliberate about that time until the past 4 days, so he ended up getting himself hurt because he let himself get too attached before he realized I'm not what he wants. That made me feel really good about myself, knowing that I know myself well enough to know what I need, how I work, and how to take care of myself.
- You can't be in a successful relationship with someone else until you know yourself well enough, and the only way to get to know yourself that well is to take the time to yourself!
- I still don't know exactly what God is teaching me, but no doubt he will show me. I don't believe he's teaching me not to date non-Christians, but we will see. Vin thinks it actually is a good idea that I date only Christians, which is the first time I've ever heard someone who's not a Christian say that.

Added this morning:
Just kind of amusing, I took myself out to breakfast this morning after my dentist appointment (whenever I'm sad or break up with a boy, which are not necessarily the same thing, including in this case, I spoil myself... I go shopping and generally tend to let myself do things I wouldn't do, like get breakfast by myself). So anyway, I'm just finishing up breakfast and I go "sooooooo good, so worth breaking up with Vinnie for". I said that to myself (or maybe Jake) but it was so funny for some reason, I just started cracking up. Maybe it's not funny when I repeat it back, but I found it quite amusing. Okay I'm done now. :)


Jenni said...

WOW, big long post. But it sounds like you really do know yourself well enough to understand why something can't work. And it takes two to work something as big as different values/religions and if someone thinks they can't deal with it, unfortunately they probably can't. I'd say dating non-christians is definetly an option but for you that would mean alot of things that you don't have in common with that person. Also, there's a huge set of values that goes along with it. I would say you're more likely to date someone of another faith than someone who is an athiest. Believing in God is fundamentally important to you. I think I had this whole process for me too, I dated someone who was pretty conservative. And I thought, wow, I don't know if this can work, I'm very liberal. But really, I could date someone who was conservative who was politically active, it ended up that my problem was really that the guy wasn't at all interested in politics which is something I'm active with. The passion I have for politics will have to be understood and shared with the guy that I love. So that's MY dealbreker.

Kelly said...

Good point that it takes two to work out the differences in values/religion. Didn't think about that but it's totally true. :-) But it being more plausable to date someone of another faith than an athiest is not true at all for me. I would much rather date someone who is athiest or agnostic than another faith. I thought about that a lot when I was dating Vinnie and I stand by that statment.

And now... off to dinner with Vinnie and Kristie. :-) (I know, I'm weird... but it works, and that's what matters)

Jenni said...

This is all very strange, because my lecture tonight ended up talking about values and the professor said point blank, if your spouse/significant other does not share your core values that you will have constant conflict. AND your values inherently influence your behavior, so it will be hard to understand someone's behavior if they do not share your beliefs. She said she'd been married 23 years and that there was no secret, just that her husband and she shared the same core values. So I think this is a very WISE and ADULT decision to avoid constant conflict and disappointment. And I know there are hundreds, thousands of men out there that share your beliefs. So that's good news too!

Jenni said...

Also, you randomly switched from the pink blog. I just noticed.

Kelly said...

"if your spouse/significant other does not share your core values that you will have constant conflict. AND your values inherently influence your behavior, so it will be hard to understand someone's behavior if they do not share your beliefs." -- from Jenni's comment. I'm not sure that at this point I believe that 100%. I think that there's a lot of truth to it, and it definitely makes it easier to have the same values, but I'm not ready to let it be a dealbreaker. I mean, obviously it was for me and Vinnie, but I'm not ready to say that it always has to be. I'm not discounting it, but I'm just not sure yet. Something I'm certainly going to think about, although in an ideal world it won't matter anymore in my life. :-)